228 thoughts on “Myrna Loy Movies”

1. THE LAST OF MYRNA
   Hopefully the final and definitive word on Myrna’s status in the Hollywood of the Joan Crawford.era
   1
   Melvyn Douglas and billing. Douglas – “Well, Freddie Bartholomew had first billing in Captains Courageous and that drove Spencer Tracy mad. I was billed fourth – and couldn’t have cared less. Joan Crawford once explained to me she was over Clark Gable and William Powell but under Norma Shearer. Powell was under Jean Harlow but above Bob Montgomery and Myrna Loy. Are you still with me?” JFB (Just for Bob)
   2
   The foregoing is Para 8 of the Work Horse’s Possibly Interesting Facts on his excellent Melvyn Douglas page and it tells an amusing yarn about billing and highlights again Old Cantankerous’ obsession with it even when he had just become a star. For once I almost feel sorry for Old C as he clearly took himself very serious but in Captains Courageous was 2nd billed to a mere boy. Still the old devil had the last laugh winning the Oscar for his role in that movie.

   Though Melvyn [clearly a kindred spirit of John!] personally found it all very amusing there was obviously a deadly serious pecking order in Old Hollywood and everyone knew his/her place in it. If you follow to its end the ‘billing chain’ that Melvyn recites it is plain that M-s Loy is the very last link in that chain! – and the heading above was not intended as a pun! GREAT piece of trivia recounted here though so take a bow Work Horse.
   PS
   The para 8 was tagged Just for Bob so I felt entitled to reproduce it here but I apologise to anyone who is bored with the repetition. Just think though I could have imposed a repetition of Hirschhorn’s comments on readers and who wants to keep reading THAT stuff?

   Reply

   1. Hey Bob
      1. Glad you enjoyed this Melvyn Douglas’ interesting fact.
      2. I have never said…Loy was the best actress…..just the actress with the best box office total….I know I am a broken record here.
      3. The billing had an order….but everybody Joan (he was quoting her) was a above the title star…..and Loy was an above the title star.
      4. I like Spencer Tracy….but like another favorite, Bruce Willis, I get the feeling they are not the nicest people off camera. Granted…in my family history…..they had good encounters with him when he bought fruit from their stand they ran:…..despite that…there are so many stories of his and Bruce’s bad behavior it makes you wonder….just how happy they were.
      5. No problem posting the fact here…..anything to keep Joel and Myrna in the spotlight is fine with me….lol.

      Reply

      1. HI BRUCE
         1 In para 3 of your post you say –

         “The billing had an order….but everybody Joan (he was quoting her) was a above the title star…..and Loy was an above the title star.”

         2 If you go now to Wikipedia and look at the poster reproduction for the 1933 When Ladies Meet you will see that the billing – and size of same – is as follows:

         ANN HARDING
         ROBERT MONTGOMERY IN
         WHEN LADIES MEET
         Also Starring Myrna Loy, Alice Brady, Frank Morgan

         And of course that soft touch Cogerson credited M-s Loy with a whopping $90 million for this movie

         3 Anyway Quiz question of the month – “Would Spencer Tracy been delighted to be told that he was being billed above the title in 6th place?”

         4 By the way interesting you should mention the other Bruce as I’ve just watched a 2000 episode of the TV sitcom Friends in which Willis did a guest spot and was very funny. He could do comedy very well I thought.*** The DAN-LIKE link was that he had to share some scenes with Matthew Perry as Chandler Bing in the series and of course Willis and Matthew appeared together in the cinematic movie The Whole Nine Yards that year and its sequel The Whole Ten Yards in 2004. I too have read unflattering things about the off-screen Willis but I read also that after they divorced he continued to help and advise Demi with her problems and if so I admire that because it’s nice to see a divorced/separated couple continuing to show each for other respect and not completely jettisoning what they once had with each other. Anyway I don’t really care what Bruce was like off-screen because I enjoyed immensely his screen persona and it was THAT which I was paying for. .

         ***In a Richard Harris interview that I’ve just watched he said that his Bounty co-star Mr Mumbles “could do anything BUT comedy” so a feather in your cap there Mr Willis.

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         1. Hey Bob. Loy was not above the title for every movie she ever made, but she is above the title in over 50 movies.
            For a good 15 year run, she was one of the most popular actresses and most famous woman in the world. Her long career is why her box office career grosses are so stout.

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            1. 1 The quiz question at No 3 in my 3.43 post on 24 July has not been answered so it has been carried over for another week.

               2 My 24 July post also prompts another quiz question – Was Ann Harding a bigger star than Myrna Loy back in the 1930s?

         2. Hey Bob….I would say Tracy would not be happy…..but it seems to have been pretty difficult about things like that….I think I like stars like Melvyn Douglas and Myrna Loy who did not really care too much.

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   2. Hello Bob,
      I like so much this comment about Crawford explications about over and under and near with all the Big stars of MGM.It Is like a game…and i can imagine the eyes of Crawford when She spoke oh Shearer…
      And are You Still with me??? fun..we can play with Paramount too….etc
      Thank You so much for that..
      A very good comment

      Reply

      1. HI PIERRE

         Glad somebody likes some of my stuff. John and Flora used to appreciate it at times but they give it a miss these days and I’m inclined to think of myself as the 1956 High Society’s C K Dexter- Haven [Bing] to whom Sinatra sang –

         “I have heard
         That in this Clan
         You are called
         The Forgotten Man!”

         Sadly usually all I’m left with is that Work Horse guy who keeps trying to brainwash me with the ramblings of a Joel Hirschhorn – ever heard of HIM?

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         1. PIERRE 1 On reflection I was possibly being unfair in putting you on the spot by asking you if you knew who Joel Hirschhorn was because you mightn’t want to offend Bruce by replying in the negative. I belong to a loose and informal group of about a dozen amateur film buffs and none of them had ever heard of Joel except one woman who had the vague notion that he was an American TV talk-show host of the 1950s.

            2 When I told the group that Hirsch had conducted a one-sided savage character assassination of MB there wasn’t much of a reaction because a number of my group don’t like Brando anyway However we are ALL John Wayne fans and when I revealed that Joel had also rubbished the Duke there was an outburst of spontaneous laughter accompanied by some sarcastic comments such as “What planet was that guy from?” and also some expletives-deleted about Joel.

            3 Indeed it is probable that Joel’s name was not too familiar even among the contemporaries of his day. In the 1950s we had a chat show over here called What’s my Line? in which in question and answer sessions a panel of four TV celebs tried to find out the initially undisclosed occupations of contestants from the general public. There was a regular 5 minute spot on the show in which the panel donned blindfolds and tried to guess the identity of a mystery guest superstar from personal answers that the guest gave to set questions.

            4 On one such occasion the Duke who was touring different countries to promote The Alamo in 1960 was the mystery guest and although he was at the height of his popularity then and had difficulty in disguising his distinctive drawl it took the panel the whole 5 minutes to identify him. Those panel members have long since sadly passed away but had Hirsch appeared before them I’m sure they would have remained mystified about him even when they went to their graves. In short Pierre ignore my question about Hirschhorn. [Instead of calling him Hirsch should we nickname him Hearse?]

            NB: I remember that episode vividly because within the panel a good cop/bad cop routine was invariably carried out with three of the members always being if anything over-deferential to the mystery superstar when his/her ID was revealed but with the 4th a cantankerous Tracy-like character named Gilbert Harding being deliberately obnoxious as was his habitual calling-card. He said to the Duke “I’m surprised that you didn’t turn up here in that ridiculous coonskin cap that the Crockett chap wears in your movie.” All credit to Big JW he did not permit himself to be drawn into becoming Stonewall Torrey but simply smiled sweetly at Harding.

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            1. EXPLANATION

               When I joked about calling Joel” Hearse” I meant no disrespect to the dead but instead was spoofing about Joel being a ” back number” from yesteryear whose career as a movie pundit might now be irrelevant. However if anyone found my jest offensive I sincerely apologise to that person.

            2. Hey Bob…..I am sure you are correct….film critics are not too aware of Joel Hirschhorn…..his first love and the reason he is known is his music. His book, Rating The Movie Stars is the only time he looked at movie criticism.

               I did not realize it was the John Wayne rating that had gotten you so fired up. If fairness to him….Joel did rate every single one of Wayne’s movies made in the 1930s…..and even Wayne would say most of those movies are pretty awful.

               He still gave Wayne lots of 4 star performances”
               1939’s Stagecoach
               1940’s Long Voyage Home
               1940’s Seven Sinners
               1945’s They Were Expenable
               1948’s Fort Apache
               1948’s Red River
               1948’s She Wore A Yellow Ribbon
               1950’s Sands of Iwo Jima
               1952’s The Quiet Man
               1956’s The Searchers
               1959’s Rio Bravo
               1962’s The Man Who Shot Liberty Valence
               1962’s How The West Was Won (the best 2 minutes in movie history apparently)
               1969’s True Grit
               1976’s The Shootist

               Just all of those 2 star B westerns pulled down his score.

            3. Hey Bob….I am sure nobody has taken offense…..the fact that the late Joel Hirschhorn is being talked about at all has to be worth something. I actually texted his song writing partner but have yet to hear back from him. Al Kasha and Joel got Oscar nominations for three movies….winning twice. Not too bad of a statistic.

         2. Hey Bob…..the fact that you now not only are aware of Joel…..but can correctly spell his name….is a win for me and Joel….lol. Glad Pierre likes your comments…but you should know….he is not alone in that regard.

            Reply

            1. Actually it’s your surname that gives me the most trouble !! If for example I leave a couple of letters out of a reference to say Burt Lancaster the computer still picks up what I want but often I’ve found if I leave even one letter out of a request involving “Cogerson” the computer does not recognise that request and I have to spell the name fully for the request to be answered. Must be a very special surname but that’s no surprise.!!!

            2. Hey Bob…..Cogerson is a very unique name…as far as I know only one other person in the world uses that name. It is the nickname of my blended family…..WoC was born a Coats…..I was born a Rogers…..and my two middle children were born a Anderson…..jam them all together and you have COatsROGersanderSON….those Cogerson was born. Sorry if I had told you that before. One day you computer will recognize Cogerson…..just like the way Google did….you type in Cogerson in Google….anywhere in the world….and my website will pop up.

      2. Hey Pierre….glad you like Bob’s comment…and yes I can see Crawford as she speaks of Shearer.

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2. EVENING JOHN:

   1 Thanks for your further response but I have undertaken not to press this matter further because as Bruce says none of us is going to sway the other at this late stage so let’s call it a 3-way draw or if there is no such scoreline in baseball I’ll settle for Mexican Standoff.

   2 Anyway you are giving me alternative food for thought with your very interesting acts about colour in movies and i’ll be happy enough for you to keep providing. those till the cows come home.

   Best wishes BOB

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3. ANNEX B
   MYRNA LOY PURCHASING POWER OF TOP 19 MOVIES

   Airport 1975/$301 million- Heston was star Loy billed 13th
   The Best Years of Our Lives/$294
   Test Pilot/$230
   The Great Mrs Ziegfeld/$180
   The Rains Came/$164
   The End/$158 – a Burt Reynolds film – Burt billed alone above title
   Bachelor Knight/$144
   Cheaper by the Dozen/$124 –J Crain lead actress. Loy billed 3rd
   From the Terrace/$121- Newman and Woodward billed alone as stars
   After the Thin Woman/$116
   Too Hot to Handle/$113
   Another Thin Woman/$107
   Emma/$102 – Marie Dressler billed alone above title
   Libeled Lady/$94
   Double Wedding/$90
   Wife v Secretary/$80 – Harlow the King’s leading lady, Loy billed 3rd
   Mrs. Blandings Builds Her Dream House/$74
   Arrowsmith/$67 – Colman alone above title. Helen Hayes female lead
   A Connecticut Yankee/$67 – Will Rogers billed alone above title
   GRAND TOTAL $2.610 billion [Average 137.3 billion]

   Source: Consumer Price Index of US Bureau of Labor Statistics

   NOTE: In 18 (ie 36%) of Myrna Loy’s Top 50 Cogerson grossers she was just a supporting actress and was not billed as a star. Those 18 movies amount to a staggering $2.490 billion according to Bruce’s figures. A costed list can be provided on request

   Reply

   1. Hey Bob even if you take away those movies and that 2.49 her box office total is still 6 billion……which is still in the top 7 when looking at actresses. And she would be the only one penalized for not being 1st or 2nd billed.

      U r also forgetting her 53 movies that did not make my page….if those movies averaged just $18 million in adjusted gross she would be back in first place.

      I went and saw Split for the sole reason that Bruce Willis had a cameo in the movie. I imagine even though she was billed 13th in Airport 1975 a few of her fans went and saw that movie for the same reason.

      In the end I still believe she is the biggest box office star of all time. You do not…..and I am ok with that. 🙂

      Reply

4. ANNEX A
   BARBARA STREISAND PURCHASING POWER OF ALL 19 MOVIES

   What’s Up Doc?/$379 million
   Funny Girl/$366
   Meet the Fockers/$356
   The Way We Were/$353
   A Star is Born/$318
   Hello Dolly/$288
   Funny Lady/$248
   The Main Event/$224
   The Owl and the Pussycat/$223
   Little Fockers/$164
   For Pete’s Sake/$161
   Yentl/$137
   The Price of Tides/ $132
   On a Clear Day You Can See Forever/$98
   Nuts!/$66
   Up the Sandbox/$64
   The Mirror Has Two faces/$63
   The Guilt Trip/$39
   All Night Long/$14
   GRAND TOTAL $3.715 billion [Average $196 million]

   Source The Consumer Price Index of US Bureau of Labour Statistics

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5. 1 JOHN/BRUCE Cary Grant never won an Oscar but at least he was twice nominated. He was greatly underrated as an actor in my view but he can still point to his enormous stand-alone box office record to justify his deserved legendary status that AFI has recognised.
   2 Conversely Brando and Katie H had great stand-alone success at the box office but in my view in too few films compared with the likes of say Stewart or Tracy and any way the Brando/Hepburn high rankings in the AFI lists probably rest more on the perception that they were Greats in terms of acting and in Brando’s case his reputation for changing forever acting styles. With Astaire his perceived uniqueness as a dancer probably did the trick.
   3 Babs Streisand made too few films to reach a vertiginous box office total but the average attendance at the 19 movies that she did make was among the highest reflected in Cogerson. Also the purchasing power of her ACTUAL grosses would be enormous in today’s market as would that of Liz Taylor and both Babs and Liz won Oscars and Babs is said to be the only actress to receive every major show-business award across the board in films, music etc and for directorial contribution. A formerroad trip companion of Brando she is a true legend
   4 In my opinion it would have been in order to say that the movies “in which Myrna Loy appeared had the highest audience count” but to say that she is the most successful box office performer of all time is to employ the kind of hyperbole that is often associated with accolades for Samuel L Jackson. Myrna like Mr. Mumbles, Astaire and Katie was overall competent at the box office but that is all.
   5 The overkill in her case is compounded by leaving the impression without qualification that in 1937 Loy’s total grosses were the stand-out ones whereas certainly Gable, Bill Powell and Crawford had a higher count that year, and listing her as Doris Day’s main co-star in Midnight Lace is fiction.
   5 Therefore as I do not regard Myrna Loy as a particularly successful stand-alone box office performer it was only but fair that I should look at other recognised tokens of Greatness to see if any of them applied to her. There was none. She was not perceived by her peers as a particularly strong actress and when the purchasing power of her films’ ACTUAL monetary earnings is calculated although it is respectable it does not compare favourably with those of a number of other actresses. See Annexes A & B.
   6. As a movie “box office buff” I have been trying to set straight what I see as the true and indeed in some cases the official record on Loy. I would place her at somewhere near the bottom of the A list of stars of her day and do not otherwise have particular interest in her though I regard her as a passable actress.
   7 Certainly I have no fixation in the matter and for example in the past 8 days as well as my comments on the profiles in Steve Lensman’s videos I have commented on the careers of four other stars with a recent new page/update and those posts have not attracted a response whereas as soon as I say anything that tries to put Loy’s status in an honest perspective fuses start blowing on this site.
   8 However I acknowledge that the time has come to agree to disagree and after this will comment no more on Loy or respond to others’ posts about her but would ask that in future could we agree to disagree in plain English? John claims to have missed my main point about Myrna Loy and had he had the courtesy to tell me of his mystification assuming it to be the case I would have returned the compliment by informing him that I know nothing about American baseball and the comparisons that he was making in the jargon of that sport were meaningless to me so he could have been conveying pearls of wisdom and they would have sadly escaped me. “When in Rome speak as the Romans speak.”

   Reply

   1. Bob & Cogerson

      Hi Bob. On the Romans. I apologize to you, but Cogerson I think understands my points about Henry Aaron, and he’s the Roman on this board. I was worried about this not getting across, but to just restate the position–it is like Paavo Nurmi. There is no way of winning nine Olympic gold medals in track and field w/o being at least near the top and worthy of consideration as one of the best. Stats do take us somewhere.

      Cary Grant never winning an Oscar? I just don’t see any connection between winning awards and being a box-office star. This strikes me as just an effort to shift the grounds of debate. By the way, I would consider Myrna Loy sort of the female Cary Grant. An actress with subtle comic skills whose performances were by-passed in favor of sometimes heavy-handed and hammy dramatic turns when the awards were passed out.

      Stand-alone–I don’t think I agree with the concept. Which Gable or Grant movies were stand-alones. Not many. The whole point was to match them with the latest hot younger actress. The actresses wanted these matches also. It meant they had reached the top.

      Also, box-office analysis is not an exact science. The movies stars are most remembered for are often movies that were bigger than they were. Did Harrison Ford make the Star Wars movies a hit? More like they made him. The best thing which can happen to an actor over the long run is to land a role in a movie which is bigger than they are. I would say that is true of Charlton Heston in Ben-Hur, Brando in The Godfather, Gable in Gone with the Wind, and Ladd in Shane. I am not denying they rose tot he occasion, and were perhaps the best casting, but there is a synergy effect. Take Ford and Star Wars. What if Tom Selleck had been cast? I don’t see that anything at the box-office would change much except Selleck would be famous as the star of Star Wars rather than as a TV star.

      On billing–Well, third billing doesn’t mean much if the other two are big stars. It is still star billing. James Stewart was third-billed in The Philadelphia Story, for which he won his Oscar. The Quigley polls placed him ahead of both Grant and Hepburn that year and the next. William Holden was third billed in Sabrina and The Country Girl. But no question he was a big and hot star in 1954. Joan Crawford was third billed in Grand Hotel. Was she not a star? These multi-star movies were usually major efforts by the studios which grossed a lot more than typical one or two star programmers. I have a fundamental disagreement with downplaying them for not being “stand-alone.”

      Reply

   2. You ignore Myrna’s ranking as top leading lady on Box Office Top 10, being awarded Queen of Hollywood by Ed Sullivan based on poll of 20 million moviegoers, and the fact that at the height of her fame she left Hollywood to work for the war effort. She was also one of the 1st actresses to strike for pay equity after The Thin Man finally made her a star & one of the 1st to star in a successful franchise. Given that her career lasted decades on film, stage & television, and that she worked with everyone from Barrymore (both!) to Fonda and was billed above 2X Best Actor Spencer Tracy all conspire to leave your comments with little to no credibility.

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      1. Right there with dcto.

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